Frankenstein(2025) - In A Nutshell

Marc: 00:00:00

Do you guys have any idea how many Frankenstein movies have been made?

Paul: 00:00:03

Ooh, that's a good fact.

Darren: 00:00:04

Seven.

Marc: 00:00:05

You think seven?

Paul: 00:00:05

Yeah. I'll go with six.

Marc: 00:00:07

Jesus Christ.

Darren: 00:00:09

Is it two?

Marc: 00:00:10

No. Hello and welcome to Movies in a Nutshell with me, Marc Farquhar, myself, Darren.

Paul: 00:00:27

Horn, and I, Paul Day.

Marc: 00:00:28

We help you spend less time browsing and more time watching.

Darren: 00:00:31

If you've seen the movie, we'll reveal what you might have missed.

Paul: 00:00:33

If you haven't, we'll give you a quick spoiler free breakdown.

Marc: 00:00:36

We've got behind the scenes trivia, including Paul's facts of the day host ratings.

Darren: 00:00:40

And our legend league table, plus your.

Paul: 00:00:42

Chance to choose a movie.

Marc: 00:00:43

y, episode three Frankenstein: 2025

Darren: 00:00:55

Yeah, yeah. Let's pump it up. I say Franken, you say stein. Franken.

Paul: 00:00:59

Stein.

Darren: 00:01:00

Franken.

Paul: 00:01:00

Stein.

Darren: 00:01:01

That's the energy we're gonna have in this podcast.

Marc: 00:01:03

Okay, There we go. It.

Paul: 00:01:04

I feel like they're joining in already. They're listening in the car.

Darren: 00:01:06

Yeah, everyone will be, except my students. Every time I do a call, calling response, response. Yeah, they don't do it. I'm like, I say media, you say who you are. Media.

Paul: 00:01:17

Well, if you're listening, students, you should join in with Darren.

Marc: 00:01:20

Yeah.

Paul: 00:01:20

And yes, I picked Frankenstein because I hadn't seen it. So.

Marc: 00:01:23

Have you seen it, Darren?

Darren: 00:01:24

No.

Marc: 00:01:25

So this is the first. I think it's the first film we've picked what none of us.

Paul: 00:01:27

None of us have seen. Yeah, I just had it on my list and it was like, you know what? I want to watch that.

Marc: 00:01:31

Come on.

Paul: 00:01:31

Cool. I've heard good things. Let's throw it in.

Marc: 00:01:34

Nice. So we're in part one, which we call the nutshell, where we will break the movie down.

lp you decide if Frankenstein: 2025

Darren: 00:01:44

Well, it's Frankenstein, so everyone knows, everyone.

Marc: 00:01:46

Should know the story of Frankenstein.

Paul: 00:01:48

It's a mad scientist trying to bring life where there is none.

Darren: 00:01:51

And it's got themes of like man versus God, I think more up to date. You could easily code it as, like man versus AI or AI versus God. It's sins of the father to a certain extent as well. Obsession, regret, forgiveness.

Marc: 00:02:05

Yeah.

Darren: 00:02:06

It's also. I love subjects like this because I've gone on, I wouldn't say rants. I think it's out of character. To say I'd go with a rant.

Paul: 00:02:12

I don't know.

Marc: 00:02:13

I would say that's fairly like a sound effect for him. Here comes a Darren Horn power rant.

Darren: 00:02:21

Yes, power run. I find genre so interesting because everyone has assumptions of what it is. And we've clashed a few times over what the genre is.

This is science fiction.

Marc: 00:02:31

Yeah.

Paul: 00:02:32

I would have said period horror.

Darren: 00:02:34

It's a gothic horror.

Paul: 00:02:35

Science horror. Yeah.

Marc: 00:02:37

There's definitely some fiction in it.

Darren: 00:02:38

Well, this fiction. Exactly. But everyone thinks, oh, science fiction.

Marc: 00:02:41

It's when you go back, this happens all the time. You go back to the original meaning of the term or the word. It's kind of got skewed what it means since.

Darren: 00:02:47

But it goes further than that because whenever I've gone, it's probably the Alien episode. I did this where I'm like, this is a horror movie, not a science fiction movie.

Marc: 00:02:53

It's definitely more horror than science science fiction. It's more.

Darren: 00:02:56

But for me, sci fi makes you think about. About life, the universe and everything is like, is there a God? What does it mean to be human? So Blade Runner, I would class as sci fi.

Paul: 00:03:04

That's another one where you like create life and then what does that mean if you've created.

Darren: 00:03:07

Exactly right.

Marc: 00:03:08

Never seen it.

Paul: 00:03:09

What?

Darren: 00:03:10

Somebody's got to call that in. But yeah, you know, as we're going to see this movie is talking about those types of things. What does it mean? What is a soul? What is God?

What is humanity? And so totally science fiction.

Marc: 00:03:21

It's kind of. It's not about creation itself. It's more about the responsibility of creation.

Darren: 00:03:24

Yeah, that's a good way of putting it.

Paul: 00:03:25

So I was just trying to think of what it reminded me of and out the gate. I kept thinking of Johnny Depp films and then thought at one point Johnny Depp could probably have played Frankenstein in this.

Marc: 00:03:33

Why did Johnny Depp come to your mind?

Paul: 00:03:34

I don't know. It just reminded me of like Sleepy Hollow from Hell. Edward Scissorhands, Tim Burton films Sweeney Sweeney Todd.

Marc: 00:03:42

Yeah, right. So have you got a meatball? Are we going to meet a meet off?

Paul: 00:03:45

I did write one down, but I don't think it was very good.

Darren: 00:03:47

It's like Dracula meets something.

Paul: 00:03:50

I'd like Beauty and the Beast down as well. I don't know, like Pride and Prejudice meets Beauty and the Beast. Is that somewhere near Dracula meets Blade.

Darren: 00:03:57

Runner kind of works.

Paul: 00:03:57

Oh, that kind of works.

Marc: 00:03:58

I've got Pan's Labyrinth meets Elephant Man.

Darren: 00:04:00

Panzer Labyrinth is good because that's Del Toro. Elephant Man's David lynch, which is also a little bit weird and out there.

Paul: 00:04:05

So we've thrown enough at them in this nutshell already, because do we think most people know at least the story of Frankenstein? They'll know the rough story, surely.

Marc: 00:04:12

I hadn't seen. I have. Before this, I hadn't seen any.

Paul: 00:04:15

And I hadn't either.

Marc: 00:04:16

I've seen a single Frankenstein at all, ever.

Paul: 00:04:18

But you still knew the basic story.

Marc: 00:04:20

But I knew the story, and that's.

Paul: 00:04:21

The same as me.

Marc: 00:04:22

And I know how people often get confused with this.

Darren: 00:04:24

Frankenstein is Frankenstein's monster.

Marc: 00:04:26

Yeah. They think Frankenstein is the monster, but Victor Frankenstein created the monster.

Paul: 00:04:29

Ah. So we should probably tell people that. So if you're thinking Frankenstein is the monster, it's not.

Frankenstein's the story of the creator of the monster.

Darren: 00:04:35

But then I saw a really cool article.

I don't know what it was on where they were saying this was like months or a year ago, that Gen Z are now reading Frankenstein in a woke way and they're sympathizing with the monster. It's like you're always so supposed to. The monster is sympathetic. That's the point.

Marc: 00:04:49

I mean, it's basically about when a life is brought into the world without love, guidance or belonging.

Darren: 00:04:53

I suppose it's also one of the things that I used to talk about more when I was a newer parent, but it's the parental feeling.

When you have a child, a lot of the time you will project what that child is going to be like before they're born, which is a really dangerous thing to do, like, oh, I'm going to have a boy. So they really like football or whatever it is. And sadly, you can't. You don't dictate what your child is going to be like.

And certainly in my experience, there's a lot more nature versus nurture. You know, I've got a musical theater kid. We didn't do that. We never watched musical theater.

But now I've just been to see Six, a musical, and that kind of thing's not going to go away.

Marc: 00:05:25

Of Six, I didn't even know what that was. I saw it on your socials. I was like, I have no idea what that is.

Darren: 00:05:29

It's about Henry vii, Six Wives, that it's. Or like feminists and fun is good. So I think there's an element of that.

You're kind of projecting what you want your creation to be and then it not quite being the way you wanted it.

Paul: 00:05:39

So life, death, rises, falls, all that stuff. The Bigger themes.

Darren: 00:05:43

We nailed that one. Just saying. Gold stars all around.

Marc: 00:05:46

Let's move on to part two, which is the unboxing. In Part two, which we call the unboxing, spoiler territory ahead.

you want to see Frankenstein: 2025

So in part two, we have what did you miss? Where we will highlight things you may have missed. Even if you've seen the movie many times.

Paul has his formidable facts of the day and then we round it off with Hate it or Rate it, where we each give our brief opinion a score out of 10 and then we throw it into the Legend League and see where it lands. So what did you miss? I'm going to go to Paul first because it was his choice.

Paul: 00:06:25

I don't think we missed anything. There we go. Moving on.

Marc: 00:06:27

What you see is what you get.

Paul: 00:06:28

There's big themes in this. On the surface level, you've got mad scientists, grace, monster, monster can't die, chases mad scientists around.

That's the top surface level bit of it. But then within that is all the stuff Darren started hinting at the start and that there's mortality, death.

If you create something, what happens after you've created it and you haven't given it a world to live in? And obviously we're in spoiler territory now and it's where the monster's like, I'm different from everyone else.

I need you to create me a mate because I can't live alone in this world on my own. It's kind of a story of tragedy, like we said at the start as well. Frankenstein is not a likable guy in this. No, he's not likable at all.

Darren: 00:07:05

Isaac should be commended for taking a role that in kind of in depth and isn't that likable?

Paul: 00:07:10

And obviously he's done family stuff. He was in Star wars and X Men and he's.

Darren: 00:07:14

Yeah, he's a growing star. He's on the rise for sure. And so it's an interesting role to take a lot of.

You know, there's a period where, like, some other bigger stars wouldn't take these kind of roles.

Paul: 00:07:25

The clever bit, I suppose, of this film, and I don't know if this is how it's done in the book or it's done in other movies, because I've never seen them, is where it flips it halfway through. So you get Frankenstein's point of view for a lot of the film, and then it flips it and you get the monsters.

Darren: 00:07:38

Yeah.

Paul: 00:07:38

If you. Oh, the monster. The.

Darren: 00:07:39

Yeah.

Paul: 00:07:40

Call him the monster. Is that.

Darren: 00:07:41

Yeah, the creation.

Paul: 00:07:42

The creation. That's better. I feel like he's not a monster, so I don't want to call him that. Yeah, the creations. Point of view.

And you really sympathize with his and hate Frankenstein even more.

Darren: 00:07:50

Yeah. Which is like a Rashomon device, isn't it? But it also means you've got two potentially unreliable narrators.

And I think Oscar Isaac's character Victor, says something like, I'm going to tell you the story. It's all factual, except when it isn't. But even then it's true.

Paul: 00:08:05

You love an unreliable narrator.

Darren: 00:08:06

I do. Because it's great to be like, yeah, this is bullshit. Yeah, I do like that.

I also like the fact that I think the links to AI were stronger than I've ever seen them or thought about them in relation to Frankenstein.

And I think it's really good that it was made at this time, Particularly the scene where he's presenting to the science board, the medical board, and he's got like half a human, and it looks like the robots or my robot, and then he throws a ball to it and it catches. That's a test that you do with AI in robotics. So I was like, he's basically built a human robot here.

And then it's about, you know, giving it, and he's like, it's got reason. And so that's. That's where we are right now, the cusp of. Is it what you call it a program or is it self aware?

And so we're kind of following that guy. So then it does become man versus God, because we want to create, and we're creating AI, which is terrifying.

Paul: 00:08:56

Right now we're heading towards Judgment Day.

Darren: 00:08:57

So then it's man versus AI, and then eventually it'll be AI versus God, because AI feels like it's already philosophizing a bit.

Paul: 00:09:04

He's quite worrying in that sense.

Marc: 00:09:05

So I've not seen any of the previous incarnations this movie already in the book. So how true is this version of what happens in this movie to the actual. The written version or the original versions of Frankenstein?

Darren: 00:09:15

The ending in the book, from what I can tell, is a lot more down. I think he gets burned. He basically tries to kill himself. And the brother is barely spoken of.

I think it's five or Something and it's like he's mentioned but he isn't a big part.

Paul: 00:09:27

So they've updated the story to a certain extent.

Darren: 00:09:29

So I'm not that familiar with the book.

Paul: 00:09:31

No.

Darren: 00:09:31

But yeah, a couple of changes. But I think you should do. You should make changes depending on like the zeitgeist or the period of time where you're making stuff. And that's how you.

Which is why, you know, in other movies, I don't mind when they start changing characters and being, oh, now African American and now it's a woman. So yeah, just change, mix things up, it's okay.

Paul: 00:09:46

And the stuff comparisons, very topical like you say, because say we'd brought this film up maybe 10 years ago, would we have still been thinking of it in the way we are or is it.

Darren: 00:09:57

No, no.

Paul: 00:09:57

So in your face right now.

Darren: 00:09:58

And they say something like this is a medical board or whatever, not a carnival act. And then they're like, switch it off. And I'm like, that's what we say about AI we say switch it off.

Like if it gets too out of control, we're going to switch it off.

Marc: 00:10:09

Does a good use of using silence more than dialogue at times to build the emotion. Certain points like this times when you realize not many words said because he Obviously it's. It's necessary to tell a story in parts.

Darren: 00:10:20

This is also a great. Means Del Toro anyway. And I love.

I don't always like his films, but I like him as a filmmaker because he's always doing something kind of in depth and he works really well with the costume and production.

Paul: 00:10:29

Yeah, visually this is stunning.

Darren: 00:10:31

Oh, it's absolutely.

Paul: 00:10:32

Which is up there with Del Toro's.

Darren: 00:10:34

Yeah, but he said, he said, I don't want digital, I don't want AI, I don't want simulation. I want old fashioned craftsmanship. I want people painting, building, hammering and plastering.

And so like the ship was built, the lab was built, it's all.

Paul: 00:10:50

And you almost feel that when you're watching it because normally you can tell. I think we've got to a point where when CGI and computer graphics first came out, we used to sort of go, oh, that's impressive.

And now we're so jaded by them.

I think sometimes we just assume everything must be computer generated to the point of sometimes you'll be watching something that is on a set and you go, oh, well, they've clearly just done it.

Darren: 00:11:10

On a green screen, isn't it?

Paul: 00:11:11

But on this one you did feel that tangibility, especially in them. Grand Sets and castles and things.

And it is a shame because I remember, I think it was even the Star wars prequels where you would say, oh, it's all cgi. And I watched all the behind the scenes stuff and a lot of it was miniatures that they then, you know, superimposed with cgi.

But everyone was like, oh, it's all cgi. And it's like, no, actually that. That palace there, to get the waterfalls, they use salt and they film the salt coming out of the salt to the day.

Oh, sorry. I know. For a different film. But it was like lots of elements put together because this was early cgi. Now I guess they just type it in. Waterfall.

And this is where AI is going, isn't it? Like, I want a spaceship and a battle and there it is. And that's what's so scary for probably creators of things and artists.

Because if AI is taking that creativity away from, you know, the artists, we're just going to be left with.

Marc: 00:11:59

With.

Paul: 00:11:59

Well, I heard a lot of people call it slop. Yeah, like AI slop. Rather than proper craftsmanship.

Darren: 00:12:04

Without a doubt.

Paul: 00:12:04

When you got old cathedrals and you visit in Prague and Venice and all these places, you go, how did they do this?

Darren: 00:12:11

And that's it.

Marc: 00:12:11

You need.

Darren: 00:12:12

You need an artist, like a visionary. And Del Toro is a visionary who, who pieces together all these parts and works so well with all the departments, even down to color.

And we mentioned color quite a bit on other movies, but he associated greens with Elizabeth, played by Mia Goth. Blue was Harlander, the brother and the father in terms of clothing.

Red was the mother and Victor, because again, Victor and the mother had like a close relationship, so they were coded color wise. I love the fact he wasn't always trying to be a period piece as well.

And I saw the tour were talking about how he wanted Victor to look more like Mick Jagger. And I'm totally here for that style.

Paul: 00:12:47

Yeah, I get that.

Marc: 00:12:48

He was a handsome man for the time, wasn't he? Like the sideburns.

Darren: 00:12:51

Oh, yeah. And then as the childhood kind of period of the story was either not. Not black and white, but blacks and whites and reds.

And I like that level of detail. I like notice and stuff like that. It's great.

Paul: 00:13:03

Yeah, you definitely feel it coming off the screen just visually. And you expect that with Del Toro, don't you? All of his films has a certain level of craftsmanship.

Darren: 00:13:11

I really love, like Myth. Like I go off on a tangent here, but, you know, I think that we have this, like Carl Jung would talk about it being the collective unconscious.

And we kind of all. All pull from the same pool of creat and memories and things like that. And he mentions so many other things within this.

Like he mentions Prometheus at one point. And I think somebody calls Victor Prometheus or what are you going to do now, Prometheus? Or is the eagle coming to peck out your liver?

Which is a Greek myth. Right, Right. Prometheus gave humans fire and so was chained to a rock by the God.

And every day a liver, a eagle comes and pecks out his liver and then it regrows and that's his torment. And they mentioned Icarus as well. Like are you going to fly too close to the sun, Icarus?

They're really painting Victor as somebody who is kind of a visionary but is also going against the will of the gods and for that and will therefore be punished by it. Which is great. I love that kind of meaning. Favorite thing they did is the big sculpture of Medusa in the lab.

The big circular one that's not there by accident.

Paul: 00:14:13

And the creation's looking up at it.

Marc: 00:14:15

Yeah.

Paul: 00:14:15

At one point and really try. Is he trying to match the face.

Marc: 00:14:19

Of that was that showed him learning? Because Victor didn't give it enough. Didn't have patience with the creation to say. Called it stupid. But he didn't spend enough time with it.

Darren: 00:14:26

I can't remember the myth of Medusa. Obviously she's transformative because Medusa was human.

Marc: 00:14:31

Snakes coming out of her.

Darren: 00:14:32

Yes. So she was human. And then her transformation, she gets turned into a gorgon, which is a snake like thing with the snake hair.

But she also transforms humans by turning them from human into stone. But I'm sure her crime is she was basically sexually assaulted in someone's temple. And I think I actually buy Poseidon.

I'm scared about saying that Rings a bell. Poseidon suddenly is very angry with me. But I think it was Poseidon Storm cloud over there and. And the goddess who.

Who was the goddess of that temple. I got a feeling it was Athena, but I'm not sure. Might have been someone else. Can't go to war with Poseidon because he's one of the big three.

And so she turns a Medusa into a Gorgon as kind of punishment for being sexually assorted. Maybe. But also to protect her from all men. So Medusa is actually a really sympathetic character who leaves civilization to be left the fuck alone.

And then all these Greek heroes start wandering over to try and kill her. It's like, how about you don't do that. And this is similar, you know. So you're linking Frankenstein to the legend. I love it when movies do this.

Marc: 00:15:37

There we go. Like, glowing, indictment.

Darren: 00:15:40

Put the myth in there, put. Put the strip, put the roots, like, build your story on the foundations of other stories. And it gives it so much richness of, like.

Paul: 00:15:49

Yeah. The legends of old.

Darren: 00:15:50

Yes.

Paul: 00:15:50

The hero's journey that.

Marc: 00:15:53

Take the best bits. Put them all in.

Darren: 00:15:54

Yeah, absolutely. Loved all that.

Marc: 00:15:56

I've always thought of Frankenstein's horror, but this is not horror movie.

Darren: 00:16:00

Well, it's a horror of humankind. It's a horror, but it's more of a.

Marc: 00:16:03

This short story is shifted from horror to. So it's a moral to moral warning. It's about choices and outcome. Like that is based on the creator's actions and his regret.

Darren: 00:16:13

Generational kind of trauma, I guess. Like, you know, Victor is beaten by his dad, played by the brilliant Charles Dance.

And, you know, he's like, no, I won't cane your hands now, because they're a doctor's instrument. Your face, however, is vanity. Whips his face. And you think, well, hopefully he's not going to turn out like that. But then Victor becomes his dad.

And it's like, I think he says to. To the creation, you only listen when I hurt you.

Say, I just did an hour's training of domestic violence at work today, and that's what I would class as a red flag.

Paul: 00:16:43

Yeah, there's the whole thing, isn't there, of kind of mankind and nature.

So there's the scene where the creation's there and he's feeding the deer and everything's peaceful and everything's great and he's learning about the world and then, oh, here's mankind again. Let's try and shoot him, because we don't know what it is. So let's shoot it.

Darren: 00:16:58

Bambi, the sequel.

Marc: 00:17:00

Yeah, but this does a good job of the. The creator's absence is more. Victor's absence is more important than his presence when it's telling the story of the creation on its own.

Like, that shows abandonment for a start, but that it builds towards feelings of regret. Like, obviously, it leads up to their meeting his. His father have his regret and the.

Darren: 00:17:16

Child also calling out the dad, basically.

Marc: 00:17:19

Yeah.

Darren: 00:17:20

And being like, this was what my childhood was. I forgive you. I'm like, whoa, that's a deep. That's a big ask for a lot of kids. And by kids, I mean anyone. Anyone with a parent.

I suppose that's a big ask for a lot of people to Do.

Marc: 00:17:35

Yeah. This movie repeatedly shows the consequences of neglect over and over again, rather than obsession.

Paul: 00:17:39

And he's still got that innocence about him.

Darren: 00:17:41

It's a bit like Ahab's kind of trick, because he's. He then just hunts him through the Arctic relentlessly. Relentlessly. So how about you just go home?

Paul: 00:17:49

It's like, I can't die, so I'm not going to kill you. I'm going to torment you forever.

Darren: 00:17:53

Yeah.

Paul: 00:17:54

Which is fair enough, I suppose, because he was pretty.

Darren: 00:17:56

Yeah. But they started with Victor chasing him, didn't it? Yeah.

Paul: 00:17:59

Because I remember when I was watching it, I was thinking, where will it go now? You know, after the building had exploded and everything, where will it go now? And then that's where he came in.

And it's like, it's his side of the story. I'm like, ah, that's where we go.

Marc: 00:18:09

Yeah. It was. It was interesting how they had the. What happened in the past to the present getting closer and closer and closer, like I'm telling a story.

And it kept going back where they are now. They can go back. I like the two. The crossover between the two was quite good.

Paul: 00:18:19

That reminded me a bit of Christopher Nolan, sort of Batman Begins kind of storytelling, where it starts in the middle or it flashes back and it brings it all together at the end.

Darren: 00:18:29

I enjoyed that with the forgiving the father thing.

I think that an awful lot of people can continuously blame their childhood or they can blame their parents for the things that are wrong in their life or the things they perceive to be wrong, but that's going to eat you up, that you can carry that for the rest of your life. And I think if you can get to the point, obviously there's going to be so many stories within that framework.

Like, I'm not speaking for everyone, but I think if you can let any resentment towards your parents go, that's a really, really healthy thing to do. And I think if you're gonna also blame your parents for stuff, you've also got to thank them for the good qualities.

So if you've had a rough childhood, that probably gave you high levels of intuition and empathy, but you also potentially.

Marc: 00:19:07

Have the ability to take control of the situation.

Darren: 00:19:09

Yeah.

Marc: 00:19:09

Therapy we talked about, sort yourself out or make changes. Make positive changes in your life. Don't always get stuck in the past. Look forward.

Darren: 00:19:16

Yeah. And it is. It's a really kind of. It feels like a Gen C, thick, Gen Z thing. I think the millennials were doing it.

But there's a line where he says, you gave me life unwanted. And there's a common kind of mean that goes on.

Marc: 00:19:26

I didn't choose to be born.

Darren: 00:19:27

Yeah. It's like. Well, you know, I. I tend to think that we do. That we.

We chose to come into this experience to, like, taste coffee and have a first kiss and all these amazing things, but it just gets lost in the noise of living and the capitalism and the patriarchy and stuff.

Marc: 00:19:40

Anything else?

Darren: 00:19:41

Only it reminded me. There's a line near the end which broke me a little bit, and it reminded me of a David Bowie quote at the end of Breakfast Club.

It comes up on text at the end of Breakfast Club just as Judd Apatow is walking away, and it's like, don't you forget about me. And the line is, and these children that you spit on as they try to change their world are immune to your consultations.

They're quite aware of what they're going through. And I remember Breakfast Club being a favorite movie when I was a kid, because that really resonated.

And the line here is, and thus the heart will break, yet brokenly live on. And it just brought me to tears, because how many of us, whether it's heartbreak through love or heartbreak through neglect or tragedy, whatever.

And all you can do is keep living with sometimes a broken spirit or a broken heart or broken confidence or whatever it is, and hope you heal. And I think this is a story of resilience. And actually, you know, at the end where he's walked into the wilderness and he looks at the sunrise. Yeah.

I welled up. That was really, really powerful, because no matter what's going on, you can watch your sunrise.

Marc: 00:20:41

Yeah. Gave him something to appreciate, didn't it?

Paul: 00:20:43

And he can't die, so he's gonna have to keep.

Darren: 00:20:45

Which is also one of my existential massive fears of all time. The idea that we are energy and you can't destroy energy, and we are alike. We're. We're conscious forever in some form or other. Terrifies me.

Well, there's no rest like Highlander.

Paul: 00:21:00

Who wants to be live forever.

Darren: 00:21:02

Yeah, exactly.

Paul: 00:21:03

It does make you think about mortality and think, because obviously, oh, we don't want to die. But then, well, all right, then live forever. It's like, do we want to live forever? What. What are the consequences of this?

Darren: 00:21:13

Yeah. One other thing I was reminded of, though I didn't need to be reminded, is I don't want syphilis.

But also, the point of this is Christoph Waltz's character wants his brain put in the creation so he can Live forever. There's conversations now about putting brains into robots and AI so they can live forever. It's very topical, this one.

Paul: 00:21:34

And when he starts talking about the idea of starting to scream and never stopping, that was all a bit terrifying. What was that part when he was talking about his deterioration?

Darren: 00:21:43

Oh, wow. Yeah.

Paul: 00:21:44

And he says something along the lines of, yeah, the idea of screaming and never stopping screaming because I can't control it anymore.

Marc: 00:21:50

It was losing control.

Paul: 00:21:51

Yeah.

Marc: 00:21:52

That was the fear of losing control. Yeah.

Paul: 00:21:53

Like you say, living forever in another body. Oh, it's gonna be like crying off. It will be turtles, isn't it? That's right, Shredder.

Marc: 00:22:03

That takes us on to Paul's formidable Frankenstein facts of the day.

Paul: 00:22:08

For his role as the creature, Jacob Alordi studied Japanese Buta. I don't know if I'm saying that right.

Dance, which is a form that involves undignified poses and dark themes and Mongolian throat singing to capture the creature's mannerisms.

Darren: 00:22:22

I love how kind of multicultural this was and kind of bringing in whether it's Greek myth or Japanese culture or what's he throat singing? Mongolian, Mongolian. I just think it's wonderful that they did that level of research to add. And it shows.

Paul: 00:22:35

It comes through in his performance, doesn't it?

Well, Andrew Garfield was originally cast as the creature, but he had to drop out due to scheduling conflicts, and he was replaced by Jacob in the role. And the makeup team spent nine months crafting Garfield's look as the creature, but he had only a few weeks to.

They had only a few weeks to rework it for him.

Darren: 00:22:53

Del Toro is one of those filmmakers who it wouldn't surprise me if he believes in Muses, because he believes that the film will tell you what it needs and a film will reject what it doesn't want, and it will accept what it does want.

Marc: 00:23:04

So, like, hey, that was meant to happen.

Darren: 00:23:05

Yeah, but I can't imagine, like, this guy's tall and kind of lean, and I heard someone describe him as like a panther as he moves. That's not Garfield. Andrew Garfield's a fantastic actor, but he wouldn't have done physically.

Marc: 00:23:17

Wouldn't be right for that.

Paul: 00:23:18

So maybe it's good that he dropped out.

Darren: 00:23:20

Yeah, I doubt it.

Paul: 00:23:20

It's what the film wanted, so I didn't know this. Is it Mia or Maya? Mia. You say Mia, I say Maya. Tomato, tomato.

Marc: 00:23:27

His sister in law.

Paul: 00:23:28

His sister in law, Mia Goth.

And she actually plays the dual role of Victor's mother, Claire Frankenstein and Elizabeth, to create a thematic connection between the mother and potential lover, which director Del Toro felt was crucial to the story. Goth and del Toro discovered this idea during an early conversation about her experience with new motherhood.

And it allowed Del Toro to explore the themes and Victor's lifelong yearning for his mother through a single actress. I didn't realize she played both.

Darren: 00:23:55

It's also interesting to me that we know who Mia Goth is.

Marc: 00:23:58

I've never heard of her.

Darren: 00:23:59

She. She did these two kind of odd horror movies.

Paul: 00:24:04

I feel like I'd seen her somewhere before, but I couldn't place her.

Darren: 00:24:07

She was in Ex and Pearl. I know she's semi famous for those. I'm not sure what she's more for, like a low budget actress. Unless I'm a TV maybe. I know she's great, though.

She's great in this.

Paul: 00:24:16

This might be the breakthrough role then. We already hinted on this before by saying he wanted Frankenstein be less scientific and more like Mick Jagger.

But they also noted Prince and David Bowie.

Darren: 00:24:28

Oh, nice.

Paul: 00:24:28

As potential influences on Oscar Isaac, Del Toro decided to follow up his version of the Pinocchio story. I don't know if you've seen that one.

Darren: 00:24:35

Oh, no, I haven't.

Paul: 00:24:36

Yeah. Very clever film. With the Frankenstein story, with this film.

As he has always viewed both stories as two sides of the same conceptual comedy, which is interesting and, yeah, it's well worth a watch. The Pinocchio, it's all done stop motion style and it's still got that vibrant color that del Toro does. I really enjoyed that one.

So Oscar Isaac was director's only choice for role of Frankenstein. That's who we wanted. That's who we got.

Darren: 00:24:59

He wanted Christoph Waltz as well. I read. And who del Toro wants, he gets.

Paul: 00:25:03

her in Victor Frankenstein in: 2015

Darren: 00:25:10

Charles Dance is an absolute legend.

Paul: 00:25:12

He just pops up in all sorts of stuff, doesn't he?

Darren: 00:25:14

I will. I think I fell in love with him in the 80s when he was in Golden Child. Was he in Golden Child? I'm sure he's the bad guy.

Paul: 00:25:21

He was in definitely Last Action Hero.

Marc: 00:25:24

Yeah.

Paul: 00:25:24

Didn't he have, like, an eye Phenomenal.

Darren: 00:25:26

In Game of Thrones?

Paul: 00:25:27

Yes, he was. He considered del Toro. Considered. I'm avoiding saying his first name because I know I'll keep messing it up.

Darren: 00:25:33

I think I've been saying it wrong based on the interviews I've seen.

Paul: 00:25:36

Well, how do they say it?

Darren: 00:25:37

I say, like Guillermo and they say Guillermo del Toro sounds better.

Paul: 00:25:42

That's the sound. Better he's considered at one point in making the film into a trilogy. Making each part focused on one of the three main characters would have been.

Darren: 00:25:49

Cool if he just introduced. Like in the next one it'd be the Mummy. And then after that would be Dracula.

Paul: 00:25:54

Oh, like all the classics. Well, if this one goes well, maybe that's what they'll do. Remember when they were going to reboot the Universal classic monster series?

Darren: 00:26:02

Yeah.

Paul: 00:26:03

And they did the Mummy with Tom Cruise, but it didn't do well and canceled the whole universe. I think this was the start of this. Came from that.

Darren: 00:26:09

Not to be. Don't think it's racist. But also, if you're doing Hammer Horror, make it British. Don't bring in Americans in Hammer Horror.

Paul: 00:26:16

To all our American friends out there, Darren has spoken.

Darren: 00:26:18

Yeah, I don't know who I'd want to be in, but actually Brendan Fraser. That's what you should have done. Just get the original.

Paul: 00:26:24

back in as early as the late: 1990

So some of you might know of Doug Jones, but he's done all sorts of work, including Hellboy. Hellboy 2, Shape of Water. He was like the Silver Surfer in the. The original Fast Fantastic Four with the Silver Surfer.

He's very good at, like, motion stuff and often wears, you know, the suits where he captures motion capture suits. So looks like Doug didn't do in the end, obviously, but he was connected for a long time.

And Jacob Elordi cites Heath Ledger's Joker from the Dark Knight as an inspiration for his portrayal of the creation. And then one final fact, because there is a few. Because it's a shame, because I feel like I wanted to see this in a theater with. In all its glory.

But it was released in select theaters, included limited 35 millimeter and IMAX screenings on October 17, three weeks before its scheduled release on Netflix.

And however, contrary to the belief that this was the result of fan demand, the film was always set to have a theatrical release long before the Internet demands went viral. And that's always been custom for Netflix distributed films since the first distributing of Beasts of no Nation. Don't know that one.

In: 2015

Darren: 00:27:31

Yeah, yeah.

Paul: 00:27:32

So in addition to their Oscar winning and nominated film, other Netflix projects that have received theatrical distribution include Ball Burnham Inside, army of the Dead, the Prom, and Matilda the Musical. But there you go. So it was on the Cinema with a 35 millimeter print in IMAX but limited run.

Darren: 00:27:47

Cool.

Paul: 00:27:47

Oh, final Final fact. Sorry, I was. Final, final, final fact.

James Cameron claims to have done an uncredited overview of the script with Del Toro as a labor of love out of friendship. Do we think he did that?

Darren: 00:28:00

He's been talking about how he wrote Point Break and didn't get credited as well.

Paul: 00:28:03

I saw that.

Darren: 00:28:04

He's in his old age. He seems to be whining a lot. Although he said he liked. I saw this great interview with him where he said he liked Kate K. Pop Demon Hunters.

Yeah, I went in with no expectations and it was really, really good writing. I was like, you go, James Cameron. Now I've got respect for you.

Paul: 00:28:18

Jim's all over it.

Darren: 00:28:19

Less whining, more weirdly liking odd things that you shouldn't like.

Marc: 00:28:23

Or more directing.

Darren: 00:28:23

Yeah, more directing. Well, no, because then we get another Avatar. We need to stop the Avatar train and go do some cool stuff.

Marc: 00:28:28

I have something to add. Do you guys have any idea how many Frankenstein movies have been made?

Paul: 00:28:32

Ooh, that's a good seven.

Marc: 00:28:34

You think seven?

Paul: 00:28:35

Yeah. I'll go with six.

Marc: 00:28:37

Jesus Christ.

Darren: 00:28:39

Is it two?

Marc: 00:28:40

No.

Paul: 00:28:40

Is it like a hundred or something?

Marc: 00:28:42

In the: 1910

Which it became the Universal monsters era.

re was Bride of Frankenstein,: 1935

d Costello Meet Frankenstein,: 1948

. The Revenge of Frankenstein: 1958

Paul: 00:29:35

Barely taking a breath Here, listen.

Marc: 00:29:37

The Evil of Frankenstein,: 1964

Paul: 00:29:50

In Knew about that one.

Marc: 00:29:51

ations. Frankenstein unbound,: 1990

. Mary Shelley's Frankenstein: 1994

Paul: 00:30:04

Yeah. I think that was a bit of.

Marc: 00:30:05

An influence on this one,: 2000

Darren: 00:30:15

Did you say League of Extraordinary Gentlemen?

Marc: 00:30:17

No, I didn't say that. No. No.

Darren: 00:30:19

I might be wrong then.

Paul: 00:30:19

Mr. Hyde's in that, isn't it?

Darren: 00:30:21

Oh, it's hard.

Paul: 00:30:21

Yeah.

Marc: 00:30:21

Let me finish. Frankenstein: 2004

I. Frankenstein: 2004

Frankenstein: 2025

Paul: 00:30:44

Wow.

Darren: 00:30:46

Well, this does a good job of breathing fresh life into it.

Marc: 00:30:50

Oh, I see what you did there. See what you did there.

Darren: 00:30:53

Boom.

Marc: 00:30:54

here was a Frankenstein movie: 2023

Why do people keep. Over and over and over again?

Paul: 00:31:05

Maybe because it's a classic.

Darren: 00:31:06

I also think there's stories that somehow sync with our kind of psyche or unconscious. And we. You want to keep prodding it. You can't walk away.

Marc: 00:31:15

Other ones. Dracula, that's had many adaptations, like, I think Aliens.

Darren: 00:31:19

Probably the same. It's like a creation that we just. There's something about it that it. It goes into our, like, deep.

Marc: 00:31:25

What's the word?

Darren: 00:31:25

I'm looking like primordial, hollow psyche or something.

Marc: 00:31:28

Other characters, like the werewolf, that's been in many, many films. Yeah, but just obsession with that Batman, that's has so many different.

Paul: 00:31:35

Yeah, but let's not give Marvel too many ideas, because the way the creature walks into the sunset, the end, you know, they might throw him in Doomsday or Secret wars with the latest upcoming.

Marc: 00:31:44

original. Original Draco was: 1897

Paul: 00:31:50

Wow. So it makes you. When were the books.

Marc: 00:31:52

first werewolf? The Wolfman,: 1941

Darren: 00:31:55

Yeah.

Paul: 00:31:55

Because this was set in: 1857

Marc: 00:32:01

I thought. But like, Frankenstein's not Iceconic because it's scary. It's iconic because it's elastic. Like all these reincarnations, they go.

They Kind of follow what does it begin going so long. They follow what's going on in society. Yeah, they're all going their own different ways. They all many directions. They all were many costumes.

But usually they always go some kind of full circle at some point.

Paul: 00:32:18

In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if they do another AI on the nose version of Frankenstein in the next few years. You could totally do another Irobot sort of thing.

Marc: 00:32:27

And that's all I have to say.

Paul: 00:32:28

Wow.

Darren: 00:32:29

That's the most.

Paul: 00:32:30

He's a lot of Frankenstein.

Darren: 00:32:31

That's the most he's ever spoken, isn't it? Right.

Paul: 00:32:34

He didn't pause for breath.

Darren: 00:32:35

Yeah, we're the stars. Know your place.

Paul: 00:32:39

He's the captain of this ship. What do you mean?

Marc: 00:32:43

Let's move on to hate it or rate it. I'm gonna go to Mr. Darren Horn first.

Darren: 00:32:48

Yeah, I hated it. Didn't give a like 2 out of 10.

Marc: 00:32:54

No way.

Paul: 00:32:54

After all of that.

Darren: 00:32:56

It's a masterpiece. It's beautifully made. It's wonderfully written, wonderfully acted. The production design is out of this world.

Marc: 00:33:02

Yes.

Darren: 00:33:02

I was watching it on a cold day, so I was really. I felt like I was. Was in it. I had, you know, curtains closed, like battery operated candles on. I had my log fire going themes.

Paul: 00:33:12

Going that you love.

Darren: 00:33:13

All the themes I love. And I was just like, oh, two and a half hours of this.

Marc: 00:33:19

I didn't think. I was thinking, this is Paul, you bastard.

Paul: 00:33:22

Well, I didn't think, I didn't realize that until I put it in, but I clocked it 2 hours 20 because the credits went on for 10 minutes.

Darren: 00:33:28

The fact that you checked how many credits were there? Yeah, it's.

Paul: 00:33:31

Well, I may have checked a couple of times to see how long it. Yeah.

Darren: 00:33:34

I mean that's kind of why I like this show. Like, it is great. It should get Oscars. Like it's. It's wonderful. I'm glad it was made. It's.

It's craftsmen and artists at the top of their game telling a story. And a story is well told and they're themes that I think most people, anyone who's, you know, got a parent figure in their life can. Can relate.

Relate to. I love all of it. Making you kind of question about moments.

Marc: 00:33:56

When you got excited telling us about what you liked about this film. 2 out of 10 doesn't match what.

Darren: 00:33:59

You'Ve been saying because the film is phenomenal. I just sat there bored out of my mind.

Marc: 00:34:04

But you can still recognize it was anyway that I quite like that I.

Paul: 00:34:08

Get, like, saying, actually I didn't enjoy.

Marc: 00:34:09

It, but I can, I can appreciate the art in it because there's nothing.

Darren: 00:34:12

I can, I can critique about it. I, I.

Marc: 00:34:14

When were you bored? Tell us some examples of when you were bored in this film.

Darren: 00:34:16

Oh, the opening, I thought, was actually genuinely good. I thought they opened with wonderful cinematography. It was very, very tense opening.

And it kind of, you know, obviously, I immediately go to the opening of the Thing or something like that, and the Sailor's Fear and the stuff going on with the Captain. It felt really visceral and I really felt like I was there.

I really think I felt their fear, particularly in that time period where you're not as kind of savvy. It's like, what is that creature coming to? You know, I just thought that was great. And then I just started to get a bit bored from then on.

And then I was like, okay, okay, let's, let's get going. And some of it didn't make sense, but I was just like, okay.

I was pleased when it ended and actually I was almost going to message you guys and be like, like, I don't think I'm gonna finish this. Are we allowed to not finish the movie?

Marc: 00:35:01

No, it's never happened. So, I mean, I've come closer a couple of times on some of the longer films. Just when you have a busy week.

Paul: 00:35:07

I know, fitting them in. Like, I didn't realize it was this long until I started it. And I was like, oh, they're gonna hate me for that.

Darren: 00:35:13

Like, when it's, you know, it's on streaming, I. It's entirely possible. I will teach with this. I pull out a scene and be like, look at this.

This is a great example of, you know, acting or blocking or production design or whatever it is, but I didn't enjoy it.

Marc: 00:35:25

That's fine. I can do a music sometimes like everyone else. Look at this song and I can appreciate it, but I just don't like it.

Darren: 00:35:31

Yeah, but like that with the people.

Marc: 00:35:32

I can still appreciate what's good about it. Yeah. Or I can see an artist, why they would like it. But of them, I don't like them.

Darren: 00:35:37

Well, I didn't appreciate the Beatles. I thought they would at all. And then I watched a documentary which explained what they were doing that was revolutionary. And I was, okay, cool.

They were doing that.

Marc: 00:35:45

I'm exactly the same. I'm not a big Beatles fan at all, but I totally respect and get why they were culturally and everything important. Why they're important.

Darren: 00:35:52

Yeah.

Paul: 00:35:53

I think with that. That sometimes happens, isn't it? And that's often while I'll.

I. I write stuff up because I realize the work that's gone in it, the craftsmanship and all that stuff. And whilst it might not be my thing in inverted commas, it's.

Marc: 00:36:04

You can appreciate it.

Paul: 00:36:05

You can appreciate it.

Marc: 00:36:05

Yeah. Two out of ten.

Darren: 00:36:06

Yeah.

Marc: 00:36:07

Wow.

Darren: 00:36:07

Which is actually. That is a bit harsh because what do you give Minecraft one that's valid. That's a bit too generous, actually.

Paul: 00:36:14

Giving this one more.

Darren: 00:36:15

Yeah. Okay, I'm gonna go higher. I'm gonna go 3.5.

Marc: 00:36:17

Okay.

Paul: 00:36:18

Because that seems fair.

Darren: 00:36:20

The. I did have kind of awe. Just like, wow, you guys really brought your A game. And I applaud it, but I can't see a world where I ever watch this again.

Marc: 00:36:27

Okay, over to you, Paul.

Paul: 00:36:28

I can't see a world where I'll ever watch this again either. However, I wasn't really in the mood to watch it, you know, you chose it. You know, with films where you have. I've said this before, haven't I?

Where I have to kind of be in the right mood. And I was. I was in the mood for, like, watching a daft film that was. Was really crappy. And then this was all very serious, well made.

I'm like, okay, I have to put my more academic head on here to take this one in. But it did hook me in. I loved all the stuff Darren's just explained about the filmmaking craft, the real sets. Can't fault the. The acting in it.

I did enjoy the fact of the way it was told. That kept me interested. And I was. That's where I was starting to check the time where it was like, where did he go from here? The thing's blown up.

And then when it flipped it to the creation story, that hooked me back in again. I'm like, okay, I'm down with this.

So I did enjoy it by the end of it all, but I think a lot of that enjoyment came from what you've just described of just being in awe of how great he makes scenes look. And I love the fact that it really makes. I've got an ambilight tv, so it has lights come out of the back of it and it, like, pops.

So when there's color pops on the Del Toro film, it really pops and you're like, looks good. So even if. If the film's not good, I like it when it looks good. That makes.

Marc: 00:37:39

Visually.

Darren: 00:37:40

Let's just go back to Ambulite. Does that mean you've Put like fairy lights behind it. That flash in time with the sound.

Paul: 00:37:46

It means they're already built in on the wall.

Marc: 00:37:47

It's not with the sound. With the colors and the colors on the screen.

Paul: 00:37:51

It expands the palette of the colors.

Darren: 00:37:52

Palette nice.

Paul: 00:37:54

Anyway. Yes. Colors. So I'm going to give it. What am I going to give it? I don't know if enjoys the word. I appreciated it and I left by the end of the film.

I thought, okay, I went on the journey. I did enjoy it. I'm going to give it a 6.8, which is kind of a combination. It should be in terms of filmmaking craft, probably an 8 or a 9.

Darren: 00:38:12

Yeah.

Paul: 00:38:13

But in terms of enjoyment, I'll give it a 6.8.

Darren: 00:38:15

But that's the same as something like Citizen Kane. Citizen Kane is a 10 out of 10 movie for kind of what it's done with. To the industry. I haven't watched that since uni.

Paul: 00:38:25

I've still not seen it. I've got it on a pile to watch at some point.

Marc: 00:38:28

Don't spoil it.

Paul: 00:38:28

Because everyone knows. Everyone always compares. The film critics used to make me laugh because they said, oh, it's not Sits and Kane. It's like, well, it's not meant to be.

It's Dead or Alive with Holly Valance, my guilty pleasure movie. Go on.

Marc: 00:38:38

So obviously I'd never seen in one of these before. And with it being so long and not the genre that I'm normally into, I was expecting to hate this movie. But I've really enjoyed it.

Paul: 00:38:45

Oh, that's good.

Marc: 00:38:46

Yeah. That opening scene I was in, I was like, this is good cinema. I thought I was with the horn section right in there.

Paul: 00:38:53

Yeah.

Marc: 00:38:53

Cinema I did not enjoy. Going back in time. I get. For me, it was actually quite useful. Like I didn't know the full details of the story. So it was quite.

But going from where it started going down to that for me, took it the pace of it down and I was a little bit bored there.

Paul: 00:39:07

Oh, you don't like the back and forth.

Marc: 00:39:08

The history of like the brothers when they were kids. Okay, that bit was a bit slow. But I did like it when it.

How the creation idea came out because obviously I'd never seen any sort or read anything, so I wasn't really. Those gaps weren't filled in for me. So this did all that. And yeah, then when it created it and the story when he was in the. Down.

Down at the bottom of the building from that, I really enjoyed it. I was. I was in. I was on this journey like, it didn't seem 2 hours 20. I had to watch it in two sittings because I've never have 2 hours 20.

Swear to myself.

Paul: 00:39:33

That may be a help. The only bit I was a bit like was it, like I say, is when it broke it and suddenly.

And then when it switched to the other side of the story, I was like.

Marc: 00:39:39

I think the first time I watched it all the way until the building exploded and he was outside on his own.

Paul: 00:39:44

So you almost watched it in two parts then.

Marc: 00:39:45

I did watch in two parts.

Paul: 00:39:46

No, but I mean, that's almost the way the separation.

Marc: 00:39:48

Good time for me to stop, actually, without. Without meaning to. So then the second pass was all about how his journey from where they. Where the film started. So the full circle that.

Yeah, I really enjoyed it. And like you said, there's some. I reckon I'm not film expert like you guys are, but there was some. I could tell this was well shot and well directed.

And that del Toro, he has a vision in this. It was. It was realized in this. So it was. I thought the visually, the sound, everything was spectacular. I like movies that use silence as a vehicle.

Tell the story. I like that. So I'm gonna give it a 7.6.

Paul: 00:40:17

Nice.

Marc: 00:40:17

Because I really enjoyed it. If I'd seen Load, if I'd seen all the previous versions, maybe I would be less enthralled because I know very well.

Paul: 00:40:23

Yeah.

Marc: 00:40:24

So maybe that affects my rating. I don't know. Let me calculate that.

Paul: 00:40:27

As I say, probably won't watch it again, but I feel like it's one of those that probably would be valid from watching again because there's a lot of set designers and costumes and things to take in on Netflix.

Darren: 00:40:36

There's a like 45 minute behind the scenes as well. That's really informative. And you can. You can just feel like we've talked about this with other movies. The filmmaker cares. And usually that be.

For me, that means it gets a good grating, but, you know, that's all I can care what he likes. But I still didn't like a movie.

Paul: 00:40:53

I still feel that's a little harsh, but.

Darren: 00:40:55

And it could be healing for some people if it helps somebody, you know, accept their child who. Who wasn't quite the child they wanted, or it helps a kid, you know, forgive their parents and move on. These are.

That's a good impact to have in the world.

Paul: 00:41:07

And interestingly, I went to the IMDb and thought because of. I'd heard such good things that it'd probably be up in the eight or nines. But it wasn't. It was around the seven.

Darren: 00:41:16

Yes. 7.4 and stuff. Isn't it?

Paul: 00:41:18

So maybe that's. Maybe that's for similar reasons. Maybe people just didn't link to it. And your title character isn't that. I know. You've said this before, haven't you?

You like a roguish title character that you can really sort of enjoy.

Darren: 00:41:28

Yeah. Like a scoundrel.

Paul: 00:41:29

A scoundrel, but a lovable scoundrel. Yeah. Like, who am I thinking of? Michael Douglas.

Darren: 00:41:34

Yeah.

Paul: 00:41:34

Michael Douglas Romancing in the Stone. That we did. Indian. Yeah. With the. Whereas this character's not likable. So when you.

Darren: 00:41:41

I like Hunger Games so much because they're like Hamish. Hamish, yeah.

Paul: 00:41:46

Woody Harrelson's character.

Darren: 00:41:47

Yeah.

Paul: 00:41:47

Yeah.

Darren: 00:41:47

But I like him in Zombieland as well. Just a scallywag and, er. Do well.

Paul: 00:41:50

I suppose. I suppose Frankenstein was a bit of a scallywag, but in a very different way.

Darren: 00:41:54

He's certainly rebellious. I'm going against the system. Good to you. Just trying not to torture these poor things. Yeah, that's what I was thinking a lot.

I was like, turn that machine off that. That guy's in pain.

Marc: 00:42:03

The total is 17.9, puts it in 39th place out of 54. We have a sandwich of. So it's just below. So it's just above Crazy Stupid Love and Leave the World Behind.

And it's just below the Born Identity and Awaken.

Darren: 00:42:21

Wait, who didn't like. What do we all say about Crazy Stupid Love? Did I not like it? I think I didn't like it.

Paul: 00:42:25

No, you didn't.

Marc: 00:42:26

You didn't like it.

Darren: 00:42:26

I guess. Move on.

Marc: 00:42:28

We thought it was pretty good and.

Paul: 00:42:30

I remember you saying you had liked in the past. And I think I picked it, thinking Darren might like this one.

Darren: 00:42:34

I think I was having a Woe is me life crisis of like. Yeah.

Paul: 00:42:39

This is why writing it's very worrying because you can't go back once we've put it in stone on the leaderboard.

Marc: 00:42:45

So that's what we thought of the movie. We want to know what you think, so please get in touch. You can email us hello Movies in a nutshell dot com.

Or the links to our socials in the show notes. Get in touch and we'll read your responses out on the show. Okay, let's move on to part three, which is the listener lounge.

In part three, the listener Lounge, we have the lobby where we share your comments, your questions, any messages. Then we ask our question of the Week, then we finish by revealing next week's movie. So this week we don't have.

We're going to miss out the lobby mitts partly because of time, but also because we have a few. But I'm going to build them up for the next one. We'll have a bigger big lobby next week.

If you want to get in touch with us here, you want to join the conversation, you can send. If you go to Movies In a Nutshell Dot com, you can send us a voice message or you can email us. Hello, Movies in a Nutshell Dot Com.

And we will read your responses and questions out on the show. Now, this week's question of the week. Which movie monster do you feel the most sympathy for and why?

Any movie monsters come to mind, gentlemen, Any misunderstood villains or monsters?

Darren: 00:43:43

I'm sure there is, but I can't think of any.

Marc: 00:43:45

Is Dracula one?

Darren: 00:43:46

It depends on the version of it. Is he the Vlad the Impaler, the Warlord? Is he something else?

Marc: 00:43:51

Any of the superhero villains?

Darren: 00:43:52

Oh, loads. I mean, like Thanos is the guy from Black Panther. Can't remember his name. Killmonger.

Paul: 00:43:59

Yes, that's him.

Darren: 00:44:00

He's. It's one of the things that I think Marvel does great is they have villains that you can be like, oh, actually, I can kind of see your point here.

The guy from Kingsman, Samuel Jackson's character.

Marc: 00:44:10

Food for thought.

Paul: 00:44:11

Yeah, I'm trying to think of other ones, but just go blind.

Marc: 00:44:15

We'll see.

The listeners have to say, so this week's question is which movie monster or villain, I should guess, I would say, do you feel the most sympathy for and why?

Darren: 00:44:22

Even Agent Smith in Matrix just hates his job. He's like, I have to get out of here.

Marc: 00:44:27

Sick of this.

Paul: 00:44:28

He's repulsed by that human stench, isn't he?

Marc: 00:44:32

That takes us on to next week's movie, which means it's time to spin the wheel.

Paul: 00:44:36

Spin that wheel.

Darren: 00:44:37

Come on, listeners. Don't let us down.

Paul: 00:44:39

Have we had a few.

Marc: 00:44:40

We've had a few too many to.

Paul: 00:44:41

Mention the secret window in there. Or is he. Is he finally giving up on that quest?

Marc: 00:44:46

Secret window is in there.

Paul: 00:44:47

I like his persistency.

Marc: 00:44:49

I'll read a few that are in here. We've got Titanic.

Paul: 00:44:51

Okay, Classic.

Marc: 00:44:52

is Nolan, we've got Bumblebee: 2018

Darren: 00:44:56

I freaking love Bumblebee. So if that comes up and I don't like it this time, I'm gonna.

Paul: 00:45:01

Raise call you on that.

Darren: 00:45:03

That's the best Transformers movie.

Marc: 00:45:04

Ferris Bueller's Day Off. Quality hidden figures.

Darren: 00:45:07

Oh, yeah, hidden figures. I see. Is that the NASA one?

Paul: 00:45:10

I don't know, though.

Darren: 00:45:10

It's about African Americans working at NASA.

Marc: 00:45:12

Godzilla: 2014

Darren: 00:45:15

Oh, my God.

Paul: 00:45:17

That's gonna be one of your students, isn't it?

Darren: 00:45:18

It's one of my students.

Marc: 00:45:19

Okay. Shall we.

Paul: 00:45:22

Velocity pasta, Cross between a dinosaur and a pasta.

Darren: 00:45:25

Yeah.

Marc: 00:45:26

Oh, which kind of pasta?

Paul: 00:45:29

With that kind of film, it could be either, couldn't it?

Darren: 00:45:31

It could.

Marc: 00:45:31

Shall we? Spin the wheel?

Paul: 00:45:32

Spin that wheel.

Marc: 00:45:34

Godzilla: 2014

Darren: 00:45:35

I don't know what that is. That Matthew Broderick?

Paul: 00:45:38

. This is: 2014

Darren: 00:45:47

Gareth Edwards. Did he do Rogue One?

Paul: 00:45:49

Yes.

Darren: 00:45:50

Okay, so it should be good.

Marc: 00:45:52

Directed by Gareth Edwards, produced by Legendary Pictures. Elizabeth Olsen, Bryan Cranston, Sally Hawkins.

Darren: 00:45:59

Have you seen it?

Marc: 00:45:59

No, I haven't seen it.

Darren: 00:46:00

I don't know what the story is. I've seen a lot of those King Kong version ones where they're like, Skull Island.

King Kong lives under the island, under the earth, and then Godzilla's roaming around on top.

Marc: 00:46:11

There was one. I remember there was one came out when I was traveling, and I remember seeing this. I went to cinema to see something, and it was. It was like a.

The trailer for it came on. Just one guy fishing on this with a jetty, and he's like, oh, I think I got something.

Darren: 00:46:21

Yeah.

Paul: 00:46:22

Yeah, that's like the 90s. 90s one. That's the Matthew Broderick.

Darren: 00:46:27

So we're getting a.

Marc: 00:46:28

This is another one. I've never seen a single Godzilla dealer movie in my life.

Paul: 00:46:32

Oh, well, there you go. So you're gonna know it's cool when.

Darren: 00:46:34

Godzilla's, like, fighting Mothra and stuff.

Marc: 00:46:37

So next week's movie is the: 2014

Darren: 00:46:41

And that's two monster movies back to back.

Marc: 00:46:42

Yeah, I like it.

Darren: 00:46:44

Excellent. That was a solid episode. Gentlemen.

Marc: 00:46:46

Thanks for listening, guys. We really do appreciate you taking time every week to spend some time with us, listen to us ramble on about movies. So that's it.

This episode is officially over. This is Mark saying goodbye, and it's Darren saying goodbye.

Darren: 00:46:56

For now.

Paul: 00:46:56

For the first time, I became more interested in life and somewhat less interested in death.